Vocals on Nonexistent

The vocals on Living Sacrifice’s Nonexistent get criticized pretty harshly. Personally, I don’t mind them too much. They sound to me like a less skilled John Tardy. Plus, the album has some killer riffs and tunes on it. What are everyone else’s thoughts? 

(We know ToB only cares about vocals, but most of us here are probably more nuanced )

Ambivalent. Mostly, this album needs remastered.

the vocals are the reason I don't know this record or Inhabit well...
which sucks cause I know there are some great riffs...

I will be revisiting both records to give it another shot...

They are...unique, but they didn't stop me from loving the album then and they don't now.

I can’t stand DJ’s death vocals! Although I do usually like heavy vocals (Sepultura, Mortification etc…) 

It’s a shame because the music is good.

I'm on the fourth track of Inhabit...

Nonexistent has a better overall sound but they both kill it as far as the music...

the vocals still grate me but, as I've said with a lot of other records, the music is too good not to listen...

I was kinda hoping someone would bring this topic up, and here it is!

Nonexistent is my favourite Living Sacrifice album. Haven of Blasphemy is among my favourite songs. 

I haven't listened to nearly as many albums as most of you; I don't think I've ever heard another album with vox like this. But I like it, I think it fits the album. To me they really meshed as a group, and the vocals seem to fit with the mood, instruments and lyrics.

I dig 'em. After a while the generic cookie monster vocals most death metal bands use gets boring. Those vocals were anything but. Actually that album is one that stands alone in the world of death metal. One of a handful of albums from the christian music archives that imitated nothing or could be labelled as 'The Christian alternative to..." Nothing else like it (that I know of anyway, unless someone can show me). Killer!

Dustofyears wrote:I dig 'em. After a while the generic cookie monster vocals most death metal bands use gets boring. Those vocals were anything but. Actually that album is one that stands alone in the world of death metal. One of a handful of albums from the christian music archives that imitated nothing or could be labelled as 'The Christian alternative to..." Nothing else like it (that I know of). Killer!

That's exactly what I thought! It's always a treat listening to it b/c it's different and unique.

Pethead wrote:The vocals on Living Sacrifice’s Nonexistent get criticized pretty harshly. Personally, I don’t mind them too much. They sound to me like a less skilled John Tardy.

I'm listening to Obituary right now. I'm loving it; I really like the vox.

I remember a reviewer from the time the album was released say that the vocals sound like a cat choking up a hairball.

TZ75 wrote:I remember a reviewer from the time the album was released say that the vocals sound like a cat choking up a hairball.

TZ75 wrote:I remember a reviewer from the time the album was released say that the vocals sound like a cat choking up a hairball.

it sounds like someone having seriously painful bowl movements while sitting on the throne. Iv'e slept to it many times. Music to my bleeding ears.

They wouldn't be so bad if they weren't so loud.  Some people think only the vocals are important and mix albums this way.  This is the result of that mindset.

John Tardy's vocals are legendary for a variety of reasons and he was and remains one of my favorite death metal vocalists. These are not John's vocals. 

For me, the charm of good death metal vocals is their brutality, diversity, force, and timing. John has them all. Like the toilet bowl belches of uber-brutal death metal, pig squeals of some grindcore bands, these vocals just don't work the same for me. The former are there in some measure. There's no force and here there's definitely no timing. The shame is they are so close at times! The general sound is there. John, despite being intentionally indecipherable at times, still fires out syllables with great intensity and when he's trying to be clear is venomous in his delivery. His timing is catchy and memorable. DJ garbles most of his delivery. I get it, I just don't like it as much as I wish. Almost.

Some would mock me saying this but there is an art to delivering death metal vocals. Some people have that mastered others are just growling/shouting. John Tardy is a master. DJ is trying.

John Tardy is easily one of the best DM vocalists of all-time.  And my personal favorite, at least back in the 80s/90s.

I’ve mentioned in other threads that I think the biggest problem with the vocals on Nonexistent is that they often aren’t delivered in time with the music.

I prefer Brett Hoffman over John Tardy for classic DM vox, though. (Nothing against Tardy).

Pethead wrote:I prefer Brett Hoffman over John Tardy for classic DM vox, though. (Nothing against Tardy).

Though I've covered my move to Christian lyrics only elsewhere I have to say Brett's vocals on Retribution (one of my favorite death metal albums ever) are legendary. I concur with you there. He is also in that top list.

I think what is lost on people is that early death metal was brutal but it was actually catchy as well. In the out-brutal the brutal tech death craze of the late 90's on to today many people lost that. Those old-school guys grew up on classic rock and metal where songs were important, not just the sound. The vocals needed to be part of that.

Not surprisingly the best bands (in all genres) have never forgot that, whether new or old. The rest go for sound over songs (or just aren't good writers in general). In this case, musically I think Living Sacrifice got the music right but the vocals didn't follow suit

Frozen Fire wrote:

Pethead wrote:I prefer Brett Hoffman over John Tardy for classic DM vox, though. (Nothing against Tardy).

Though I've covered my move to Christian lyrics only elsewhere I have to say Brett's vocals on Retribution (one of my favorite death metal albums ever) are legendary. I concur with you there. He is also in that top list.

I think what is lost on people is that early death metal was brutal but it was actually catchy as well. In the out-brutal the brutal tech death craze of the late 90's on to today many people lost that. Those old-school guys grew up on classic rock and metal where songs were important, not just the sound. The vocals needed to be part of that.

Not surprisingly the best bands (in all genres) have never forgot that, whether new or old. The rest go for sound over songs (or just aren't good writers in general). In this case, musically I think Living Sacrifice got the music right but the vocals didn't follow suit

Agreed. I can walk around with choruses from those classic DM albums rattling around in my head. Not so much with most of the later stuff.

Frozen Fire wrote:

Pethead wrote:I prefer Brett Hoffman over John Tardy for classic DM vox, though. (Nothing against Tardy).

Though I've covered my move to Christian lyrics only elsewhere I have to say Brett's vocals on Retribution (one of my favorite death metal albums ever) are legendary. I concur with you there. He is also in that top list.

I think what is lost on people is that early death metal was brutal but it was actually catchy as well. In the out-brutal the brutal tech death craze of the late 90's on to today many people lost that. Those old-school guys grew up on classic rock and metal where songs were important, not just the sound. The vocals needed to be part of that.

Not surprisingly the best bands (in all genres) have never forgot that, whether new or old. The rest go for sound over songs (or just aren't good writers in general). In this case, musically I think Living Sacrifice got the music right but the vocals didn't follow suit

I can't LIKE this post hard enough.

In that same vein, the great thrash bands were transitioning from classic metal.  Nowadays thrash bands think it is all about SPEED and BEING HEAVY, but they are neglecting hooks, memorability, and melody that folks reared on classic metal knew were important.

Temple of Blood wrote:

Frozen Fire wrote:

Pethead wrote:I prefer Brett Hoffman over John Tardy for classic DM vox, though. (Nothing against Tardy).

Though I've covered my move to Christian lyrics only elsewhere I have to say Brett's vocals on Retribution (one of my favorite death metal albums ever) are legendary. I concur with you there. He is also in that top list.

I think what is lost on people is that early death metal was brutal but it was actually catchy as well. In the out-brutal the brutal tech death craze of the late 90's on to today many people lost that. Those old-school guys grew up on classic rock and metal where songs were important, not just the sound. The vocals needed to be part of that.

Not surprisingly the best bands (in all genres) have never forgot that, whether new or old. The rest go for sound over songs (or just aren't good writers in general). In this case, musically I think Living Sacrifice got the music right but the vocals didn't follow suit

I can't LIKE this post hard enough.

In that same vein, the great thrash bands were transitioning from classic metal.  Nowadays thrash bands think it is all about SPEED and BEING HEAVY, but they are neglecting hooks, memorability, and melody that folks reared on classic metal knew were important.

YES. Those classic thrash bands had hooks galore. That’s why I prefer South of Heaven and Seasons in the Abyss over Reign in Blood.

Pethead wrote:

Temple of Blood wrote:

Frozen Fire wrote:

Pethead wrote:I prefer Brett Hoffman over John Tardy for classic DM vox, though. (Nothing against Tardy).

Though I've covered my move to Christian lyrics only elsewhere I have to say Brett's vocals on Retribution (one of my favorite death metal albums ever) are legendary. I concur with you there. He is also in that top list.

I think what is lost on people is that early death metal was brutal but it was actually catchy as well. In the out-brutal the brutal tech death craze of the late 90's on to today many people lost that. Those old-school guys grew up on classic rock and metal where songs were important, not just the sound. The vocals needed to be part of that.

Not surprisingly the best bands (in all genres) have never forgot that, whether new or old. The rest go for sound over songs (or just aren't good writers in general). In this case, musically I think Living Sacrifice got the music right but the vocals didn't follow suit

I can't LIKE this post hard enough.

In that same vein, the great thrash bands were transitioning from classic metal.  Nowadays thrash bands think it is all about SPEED and BEING HEAVY, but they are neglecting hooks, memorability, and melody that folks reared on classic metal knew were important.

YES. Those classic thrash bands had hooks galore. That’s why I prefer South of Heaven and Seasons in the Abyss over Reign in Blood.

YES.  BY A MILE.

Nothing against DJ or Living Sacrifice, I love Inhabit. I don't like the music OR vocals on this one.

bgsully wrote:They are...unique, but they didn't stop me from loving the album then and they don't now.

This is exactoy my take.  Nothing will ever top Inhabit for me, but while that is arguably more intense, Nonexistent is even darker.  It is quite good for what it is.