Samuel Penner no longer with For Today

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Samuel Penner no longer with For Today

Post by messiaen77 on Thu Apr 16, 2015 10:01 am

http://www.altpress.com/news/entry/for_today_kick_out_guitarist_samuel_penner#.VS-IDyaSLBQ.facebook
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Re: Samuel Penner no longer with For Today

Post by metaldude on Thu Apr 16, 2015 10:41 am

Theological differences aside, if that's the way it happened, I would have a hard time disagreeing with him.
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Re: Samuel Penner no longer with For Today

Post by Friday13th on Thu Apr 16, 2015 10:52 am

Yeah, I read it and it sounds pretty unfair. Of course we haven't heard the other side yet.
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Re: Samuel Penner no longer with For Today

Post by Grindboy on Thu Apr 16, 2015 11:07 am

Band member break-ups are like boyfriend-girlfriend break-ups.  They're hard on everybody.  The anger is always aimed at the how -- as if there's a good way to bring bad news.  The "reasons" are usually only some of the reasons.  And the details are probably better left out of the public eye.

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Re: Samuel Penner no longer with For Today

Post by d@v!d on Thu Apr 16, 2015 11:23 am

Core drama...
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Re: Samuel Penner no longer with For Today

Post by Hardcore Christian on Thu Apr 16, 2015 3:03 pm

I know we've only heard on side of the story but with For Today kicking out members because of "theological differences" like the member who was against gay people, just kicking him out because he didn't agree with your opinion isn't very Christian now is it?

The more people that get kicked out over different teaching the more I lose respect for the Leitru brother and Mattie
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Re: Samuel Penner no longer with For Today

Post by Guest on Thu Apr 16, 2015 3:24 pm

Sounds to me like the band had every right to kick him out. Missed shows, rehearsals, and flights are unacceptable in a band. If they were constantly getting a replacement player, then they did the right thing. For both parties.

Band's response:


As you may have heard by now, we asked our guitarist Sam to leave the band following our last tour. We did NOT kick him out of the band for going home to take care of a family emergency. We would never do that. The bottom line is that Sam simply has too much going on in his life to be on the road playing shows. We've seen it put stress on him over the last several months, even to the point of missing flights and rehearsals before tour to be at home longer. He went home from multiple tours (besides this last one) forcing us to have last minute fill ins for weeks of shows at a time. If you saw us play live in the last couple months, there's a good chance that Sam wasn't even on stage with us. We told him months ago that if he wanted to continue playing in the band, that he would have to make some changes. He agreed, but we never saw any change. We're definitely not perfect and don't expect perfection from anyone. But we knew asking Sam to stop touring and stay home with his wife was the right thing to do for both parties. I think it's unnecessary that internal band issues be made public and it's unfortunate that this situation has been painful for everyone involved. We have taken steps to try making this transition as smooth as possible for Sam and his wife. We all love Sam dearly and are going to miss having him on the road and on stage with us.

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Re: Samuel Penner no longer with For Today

Post by Friday13th on Thu Apr 16, 2015 4:20 pm

NoOneIsHere wrote:Sounds to me like the band had every right to kick him out. Missed shows, rehearsals, and flights are unacceptable in a band. If they were constantly getting a replacement player, then they did the right thing. For both parties.

Band's response:


As you may have heard by now, we asked our guitarist Sam to leave the band following our last tour. We did NOT kick him out of the band for going home to take care of a family emergency. We would never do that. The bottom line is that Sam simply has too much going on in his life to be on the road playing shows. We've seen it put stress on him over the last several months, even to the point of missing flights and rehearsals before tour to be at home longer. He went home from multiple tours (besides this last one) forcing us to have last minute fill ins for weeks of shows at a time. If you saw us play live in the last couple months, there's a good chance that Sam wasn't even on stage with us. We told him months ago that if he wanted to continue playing in the band, that he would have to make some changes. He agreed, but we never saw any change. We're definitely not perfect and don't expect perfection from anyone. But we knew asking Sam to stop touring and stay home with his wife was the right thing to do for both parties. I think it's unnecessary that internal band issues be made public and it's unfortunate that this situation has been painful for everyone involved. We have taken steps to try making this transition as smooth as possible for Sam and his wife. We all love Sam dearly and are going to miss having him on the road and on stage with us.

^ sounds more reasonable. It's a job, and if you're not performing adequately yeah, you get kicked out. Of course they dodged the whole theological differences discourse...makes you wonder why.

On the more humorous side of things, this is what actually went down: 

 
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Re: Samuel Penner no longer with For Today

Post by Guest on Thu Apr 16, 2015 4:34 pm

Friday13th wrote:
NoOneIsHere wrote:Sounds to me like the band had every right to kick him out. Missed shows, rehearsals, and flights are unacceptable in a band. If they were constantly getting a replacement player, then they did the right thing. For both parties.

Band's response:


As you may have heard by now, we asked our guitarist Sam to leave the band following our last tour. We did NOT kick him out of the band for going home to take care of a family emergency. We would never do that. The bottom line is that Sam simply has too much going on in his life to be on the road playing shows. We've seen it put stress on him over the last several months, even to the point of missing flights and rehearsals before tour to be at home longer. He went home from multiple tours (besides this last one) forcing us to have last minute fill ins for weeks of shows at a time. If you saw us play live in the last couple months, there's a good chance that Sam wasn't even on stage with us. We told him months ago that if he wanted to continue playing in the band, that he would have to make some changes. He agreed, but we never saw any change. We're definitely not perfect and don't expect perfection from anyone. But we knew asking Sam to stop touring and stay home with his wife was the right thing to do for both parties. I think it's unnecessary that internal band issues be made public and it's unfortunate that this situation has been painful for everyone involved. We have taken steps to try making this transition as smooth as possible for Sam and his wife. We all love Sam dearly and are going to miss having him on the road and on stage with us.

^ sounds more reasonable. It's a job, and if you're not performing adequately yeah, you get kicked out. Of course they dodged the whole theological differences discourse...makes you wonder why.

On the more humorous side of things, this is what actually went down: 

 


lol!

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Re: Samuel Penner no longer with For Today

Post by Guest on Thu Apr 16, 2015 4:37 pm

Friday13th wrote:
NoOneIsHere wrote:Sounds to me like the band had every right to kick him out. Missed shows, rehearsals, and flights are unacceptable in a band. If they were constantly getting a replacement player, then they did the right thing. For both parties.

Band's response:


As you may have heard by now, we asked our guitarist Sam to leave the band following our last tour. We did NOT kick him out of the band for going home to take care of a family emergency. We would never do that. The bottom line is that Sam simply has too much going on in his life to be on the road playing shows. We've seen it put stress on him over the last several months, even to the point of missing flights and rehearsals before tour to be at home longer. He went home from multiple tours (besides this last one) forcing us to have last minute fill ins for weeks of shows at a time. If you saw us play live in the last couple months, there's a good chance that Sam wasn't even on stage with us. We told him months ago that if he wanted to continue playing in the band, that he would have to make some changes. He agreed, but we never saw any change. We're definitely not perfect and don't expect perfection from anyone. But we knew asking Sam to stop touring and stay home with his wife was the right thing to do for both parties. I think it's unnecessary that internal band issues be made public and it's unfortunate that this situation has been painful for everyone involved. We have taken steps to try making this transition as smooth as possible for Sam and his wife. We all love Sam dearly and are going to miss having him on the road and on stage with us.

^ sounds more reasonable. It's a job, and if you're not performing adequately yeah, you get kicked out. Of course they dodged the whole theological differences discourse...makes you wonder why.

On the more humorous side of things, this is what actually went down: 

 


As for why they didn't discuss the theological issues...

Maybe they didn't talk about it because it really didn't have anything to do with his leaving. 
Sometimes even denying something is taken wrong and people will say it's just damage control and  "hey, if it wasn't true, they wouldn't have brought it up."

Maybe Sam is just being a typical fired employee and reacting bitterly.

Again..just saying maybe.

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Re: Samuel Penner no longer with For Today

Post by messiaen77 on Thu Apr 16, 2015 8:11 pm

The whole "he said, they said" thing is why I chose to alter the article headline.
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Re: Samuel Penner no longer with For Today

Post by Grindboy on Thu Apr 16, 2015 8:33 pm

Hardcore, for what it's worth the guy who had the tweet about gay people a) left, was not kicked out, iirc; and b) wasn't politically correct or overly tactfully worded, but also wasn't necessarily against gay people per se.  Again, for what it's worth.  Also, life is full of hard choices that people often won't understand.  I don't know if anybody's really "right" or "wrong" in any of this -- but that's just the thing.  We only see what we see.

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Re: Samuel Penner no longer with For Today

Post by Candlemass on Thu Apr 16, 2015 9:16 pm

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Re: Samuel Penner no longer with For Today

Post by Friday13th on Thu Apr 16, 2015 9:28 pm

^ heck yeah RIFFS!
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Re: Samuel Penner no longer with For Today

Post by Wildcat on Fri Apr 17, 2015 12:28 pm

This is going to be delicate to bring up because it's inherently theological and will be difficult to discuss, but I feel like it's necessary to at least mention for a full understanding of the situation. Just a couple of weeks ago, Mike Reynolds, the guitarist who left For Today shortly after his controversial comments on homosexuality, publicly shared his concern that Mattie is caught up in a cult. 

It's in that context that Samuel Penner's comments about theological differences and the rest of the band going so far as to tell him he was unequally yoked take on more significance. There's still a fair bit of he said/they said in his situation, and that may have truly had nothing to do with his dismissal, but the timing of the two separate, (as far as I can tell) unrelated statements from former band members related to theology does start to make the band's spiritual direction look suspect to a lot of people.
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Re: Samuel Penner no longer with For Today

Post by d@v!d on Fri Apr 17, 2015 3:20 pm

Wildcat wrote:This is going to be delicate to bring up because it's inherently theological and will be difficult to discuss, but I feel like it's necessary to at least mention for a full understanding of the situation. Just a couple of weeks ago, Mike Reynolds, the guitarist who left For Today shortly after his controversial comments on homosexuality, publicly shared his concern that Mattie is caught up in a cult. 

It's in that context that Samuel Penner's comments about theological differences and the rest of the band going so far as to tell him he was unequally yoked take on more significance. There's still a fair bit of he said/they said in his situation, and that may have truly had nothing to do with his dismissal, but the timing of the two separate, (as far as I can tell) unrelated statements from former band members related to theology does start to make the band's spiritual direction look suspect to a lot of people.
I think you are on to something. Did you see the video in that article you linked? Ouch! Anyone following Ball might want to start looking for a cool spot in eternity.
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Re: Samuel Penner no longer with For Today

Post by Wildcat on Fri Apr 17, 2015 6:07 pm

Yes, I've watched it. I was just as disturbed by it as you seem to have been.
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Re: Samuel Penner no longer with For Today

Post by sentient 6 on Fri Apr 17, 2015 11:37 pm

That group of Matties has a lot of the hallmarks of a cult. But I wasn't sure exactly what the problems with Penners theological views were ? All I could pick up was something about believing salvation is through Christ alone, but the Law is a good guide for Christian living ?
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Re: Samuel Penner no longer with For Today

Post by Friday13th on Sat Apr 18, 2015 9:12 am

^ The law meaning like celebrating all the Jewish feasts and rules found in the Torah (other than like blood sacrifices). Most Christians who do this call themselves Messianic or Torah abiding. I don't agree with it, but it's certainly not as out there as the stuff this pastor of Mattie teaches.
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Re: Samuel Penner no longer with For Today

Post by sentient 6 on Sun Apr 19, 2015 5:59 pm

Friday13th wrote:^ The law meaning like celebrating all the Jewish feasts and rules found in the Torah (other than like blood sacrifices). Most Christians who do this call themselves Messianic or Torah abiding. I don't agree with it, but it's certainly not as out there as the stuff this pastor of Mattie teaches.

I thought that Penners view had something to do with the Law and Matties pastor was something else ? Matties pastor could very well be misusing the Law in his teachings, but what was the problem with Penners views vs the other band members ?
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Re: Samuel Penner no longer with For Today

Post by Friday13th on Sun Apr 19, 2015 9:47 pm

That's it. I was only referring to Penner being a Torah-abiding Christian, not Mattie and his pastors. Mattie's pastors sound like authoritarian cult leaders from the looks of that video.
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Re: Samuel Penner no longer with For Today

Post by Guest on Mon Apr 20, 2015 1:40 am

Hardcore Christian wrote:I know we've only heard on side of the story but with For Today kicking out members because of "theological differences" like the member who was against gay people, just kicking him out because he didn't agree with your opinion isn't very Christian now is it?

The more people that get kicked out over different teaching the more I lose respect for the Leitru brother and Mattie
That all depends.  How far does this guy go with the "theological differences"? Do they affect his everyday performance and cause unnecessary friction with the rest? If so, IMO this booting may very well have been warranted.

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Re: Samuel Penner no longer with For Today

Post by Guest on Mon Apr 20, 2015 1:49 am

Wildcat wrote:This is going to be delicate to bring up because it's inherently theological and will be difficult to discuss, but I feel like it's necessary to at least mention for a full understanding of the situation. Just a couple of weeks ago, Mike Reynolds, the guitarist who left For Today shortly after his controversial comments on homosexuality, publicly shared his concern that Mattie is caught up in a cult. 

It's in that context that Samuel Penner's comments about theological differences and the rest of the band going so far as to tell him he was unequally yoked take on more significance. There's still a fair bit of he said/they said in his situation, and that may have truly had nothing to do with his dismissal, but the timing of the two separate, (as far as I can tell) unrelated statements from former band members related to theology does start to make the band's spiritual direction look suspect to a lot of people.
Whoa momma.  Only got 55 seconds into this apostate's ego-trip before shutting it down.  Equal to Paul? Yeah, and I'm the Easter Bunny.  albino

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